Homebrew Version of Rainway App For Switch Being Developed

Discussion in 'Underground Nintendo Scene' started by GaryOPA, Jul 17, 2017.

By GaryOPA on Jul 17, 2017 at 4:37 PM
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    GaryOPA

    GaryOPA Master Phoenix Admin Staff Member Top-Dog Brass

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    Streaming PC Games/Emulators to your Switch via HTML5 Vulnerability
    [​IMG]

    The official streaming app called 'Rainway' will not be out until 2018 and it still has to be approved by big 'N' once its ready, but in the meantime thanks to a recently discovered HTML5 Vulnerability in the Switch's web browser, its possible to make your own homebrew streaming app, as demoed recently by Aeronripper M on Youtube.

    NEWS SOURCE: App like rainway being developed for switch (via) GBATemp
     

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Discussion in 'Underground Nintendo Scene' started by GaryOPA, Jul 17, 2017.

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      Battlefield

      Battlefield Loyal Member

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      The emulator is slow because its a hack.

      Its Tegra X1 can run loads of GameCube games at full speed as proven on NVIDIA Shield TV.
      N64 emulation is nothing for the GPU Switch uses with a native emulator.
       
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      AlbedoAtoned

      AlbedoAtoned Loyal Member

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      Unless I'm mistaken, this is streaming games, not emulating them. It doesn't matter how powerful the switch is if it is streaming, it just needs to be strong enough to decode a video stream on the fly (which it likely can since most mobile cpu's come with an h.264 hardware decoder in the cpu and I would hope it came with an h.265 decoder as well since h.265 is starting to replace h.264) and send button commands (if it's a true game streaming solution). The actual power playing a game comes from what is streaming the game, in this a pc and an n64 emulator can run on most desktop pc's now a days. Said source device also needs to be powerful enough to encode the video stream on the fly as well. While most work playing games is done by the gpu, most video encoding takes place on the cpu, so cheaper cpu's might have trouble here.. The slowness is likely nothing more than this homebrew app being in it's infancy, but other bottlenecks to look out for are your network strength, since after all it needs to be able to handle the stream of video data, even if you are doing so locally, your internet speed, especially your upload, if you plan on playing on the go, html5 limitations, which are not likely to be a problem inherently, plus any other that the switch has in it's browser. Remember, Nintendo never intended for users to use the internet browser, so who knows what kinds of limitations they truly put in it. But even still, something like this doesn't need to even touch the gpu in order to work. Many devices play streamed games just fine despite being quite weak.

      Whatever the case, I think people are getting a little over themselves, because this is Nintendo we're talking about, they will likely not allow the rainway app. And there's no telling how far this homebrew app will go. It could become a huge thing, or it could stop development at any time. But my bigger worry is that if Nintendo willed it, an update could break it quite easily, forcing users to decide between their homebrew and newer games. If the bigger draw is something a cheap phone or tablet could do, most would likely just choose to update. I certainly wouldn't spend $300 on something a $50-$100 phone or tablet could do (and they can do a lot more), if I was going to spend that much, the games would be what I spent it on. And of course, knowing Nintendo's position and history with homebrew apps and how narcissistic they can get would tell you that they would pretty much shut this down asap, especially rainway. There are too many issues for them. The biggest is that people might play older games in emulators and stream them to the switch instead of buying those games for the 15th time. One of Nintendo's biggest sources of income is getting people to rebuy the same games over and over again. It's like another tax on top of the Nintendo Tax. And since this opens the switch up to potential vulnerabilities, it's a safe bet they will outright say no.
       
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      Battlefield

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      Rainway is for streaming as you say. Streaming to a web browser will also hurt the speed a bit.

      The GPU inside Switch/Shielfd TV supports 4K/60+HDR on streaming.
      YouTube 4K, Netflix 4K etc. and Streaming of PC games at 4K/60+HDR is supported by the GPU used in Switch/Shield TV.

      This cheap tiny GPU is a beast at streaming, but that doesen't help Rainway much if they don't make a native app.
      It will also depend if Nintendo disabled 4K, Hardware Streaming etc. in the DevKit.

      Here is the physical size of this monster of a chip for its size. Remember it even supports 1080p/60 on native games.
      According to NVIDIA and Benchmarks, this tiny chip have twice the power of 360/PS3.

      Fun trivia: This chip will never overheat without cooling even if playing 4K, or playing 1080p/60 games all day.


      [​IMG]
      ---
       
      Last edited: Jul 18, 2017
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      GaryOPA

      GaryOPA Master Phoenix Admin Staff Member Top-Dog Brass

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      @Battlefield - Only problem is the way the Switch uses the 'chip' it does overheat a bit when in DOCKed mode, as such the GPU ClockSpeed is limited, and 4K h.265 decoding is disabled and also 1 core is always not available to apps, they only have access to 3 out of the 4 cores, plus all apps must support 'portable' mode where the cpu/gpu/memory speeds are all lower, which limits their overall design features.

      Even the Rainway App currently on the Switch is using mostly HTML5 access which limits the possibilities but its coming along, hopefully Nintendo will allow it, so far the only one approved is the NicoNico app which allows viewers to access the 'videos' on the japanese version of their own Youtube, but nothing else yet.

      We will not see many apps on the Switch until their new revamped online store and network is launched in 2018, then you will see more, and there is rumors they will allow developers to be able to directly push their own apps onto the store similar to 'google play' with community policing to report the 'bad ones', but it most likely will be very sandboxed and tiny faction of the switch resources like the UWP mode on the Xbox One, where you only allow to use some power. :)
       
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      Battlefield

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      Actually you are right about Switch, but Shield TV have a tiny noiseless fan as its a stationary box.
      Infact it took me over 6 months after buying Shield before i knew it had a fan as its impossible to hear.
      I think that tiny fan can't fit inside Switch.
      Looks like its not possible to use full version Tegra X1 on battery after over 2 years on market. Not even after modifying it for Switch.
      If they could fit cooling, it would also drain battery. A degraded X1 still only gives 3+hours of gameplay on battery.

      Shield TV is the TV box as you know.
      Shield Portable is kinda like Switch, but 3+ years old. Shield Portable uses K1 chip which is 40% slower than X1 and is probably around the limit so far possible without cooling. Switch is the only portable device ever using X1 btw.

      In Benchmark i think my Samsung Galaxy S8+ have around same power as Tegra K1 used in Shield Portable.
      Cell phones is indeed far behind on power vs Tegra X1.

      Its good if Switch Store will be like a limited version of UWP store and Google Play. Thats still better than PSN.
      Hopefully everything from Kodi to calculators is allowed there thou. ;)

      Here is a picture of how small a Shield TV is vs a phone. Couldn't find a Switch comparison.
      [​IMG]
       
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      DSpider

      DSpider Loyal Member

      "Nintendo Switch Running Zelda N64 Emulator"

      It's not RUNNING it. There's no emulation going on ON the device itself. How are people this dumb? ...

      There's a clear difference between running something on it and streaming from another device that's doing the actual work. It's only being DISPLAYED on the Switch's screen, not ran.
       
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      GaryOPA

      GaryOPA Master Phoenix Admin Staff Member Top-Dog Brass

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      @DSpider -- Yeah the 'youtube demo' is titled wrong, most likely to get massive more hits, I have no control over that.

      But the news article itself is titled right and the text mentions it is 'streaming' app, not running stuff on the switch.

      There has been attempts using HTML5 on switch to run an actual basic emulator but the best they gotten is few framerates per second for nes, nothing better, when this app becomes available on the switch:

      http://www.maxconsole.com/threads/f...to-nurture-next-wave-of-bedroom-coders.44854/

      You will be able to code very simple shit on switch legally and run it, but big 'N' is limiting the 'power resources' you will be able to use to about 5% of the whole available cpu/gpu, so don't think you get any better than some simple flash-type stickman game or scrolling text!
       

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